Page 1 of 18 
 
Washington Women’s Heritage Project records, 1900-2000 
University of Washington Libraries Special Collections 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn 
December 11, 1980 
Cassette 1, Side 1 
 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  00:02 
Testing, 1, 2, 3. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  00:12 
Jeanne Biehn interviewed by Susan Ehlers for Washington Women's Heritage Project, December 
11, 1980. Okay. Start of tape one, side one. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  00:32 
Your name is Jeanne Biehn. That's J-E-A-N-- 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  00:36 
--N-E. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  00:39 
Oh, N-E at the end? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  00:40 
Uh-huh.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  00:40 
Okay. And last name Biehn, B (as in boy)-I-E-H-N. Okay. And what was your maiden name?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  00:50 
Vercoutere. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  00:52 
Ooh, please spell that.  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  00:53 
Capital-V-E-R-C-O-U-T-E-R-E.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  00:55 
Okay, do you have a middle name?  
Page 2 of 18 
 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  01:05 
Ellen.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  01:05 
Have any nicknames? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  01:12 
All the obvious for redheads. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  01:18 
[Laughs] Oh. Tribe, homeland, or nationality? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  01:21 
I'm full blood of Belgium. My parents born and raised in Belgium. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  01:29 
But you were born in this country? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  01:31 
Yes, in Minnesota.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  01:33 
Okay. Date of birth?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  01:36 
February 10, 1928.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  01:39 
And town in Minnesota? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  01:44 
Marshall, M-A-R-S-H-A-L-L.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  01:46 
Okay, and you were married to...? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  01:53 
Donald Biehn. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  01:56 
And when and where did that marriage take place? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  02:00 
May 20, 1950, Saint Paul, Minnesota. 
 
Page 3 of 18 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  02:13 
Okay, and you've been married before?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  02:15 
No. Neither of us had. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  02:17 
No common law marriages or other important relationships?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  02:20 
No.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  02:22 
Okay, and your education? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  02:25 
I went through the normal Catholic parochial grade school, public high school, in Marshall. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  02:36 
Catholic grade school and public high school?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  02:39 
Mm-hmm. Then went the necessary two years to St. Catherine's, girls' college.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  02:45 
St. Catherine's Girls College...  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  02:58 
In Saint Paul [inaudible]. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  03:09 
Okay, occupations, jobs held? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  03:14 
I was a receptionist for the Hudson Motor Company and also did freelance modeling prior to my 
becoming a stewardess for United Airlines.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  03:34 
Stewardess. Okay, skills, or interests, crafts and hobbies, talents? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  03:52 
I belonged to several speech and dramatic groups.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  04:01 
Here on Mercer Island, or...? 
 
Page 4 of 18 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  04:02 
No, back in Minnesota. I have not pursued that here, because a full-time job as wife and mother, 
but it's stillcommunications, speech, and working, also, with Clipped Wings and the retarded 
children in those areas. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  04:25 
Clipped Wings, oh, did they help retarded children? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  04:29 
Yes.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  04:29 
That's one thing I forgot to ask Timmie, either. That's part of their service organization? 
Anything else of the sort that they do along that? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  04:39 
Well, basically, Clipped Wings has, for at least 25 years, donated all their time, effort, and 
money to mentally retarded children, not only in the monetary sense, but making several field 
trips to Buckley, Fircrest, and that sort of thing, to work directly with the children. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  05:00 
Oh, I see. So, it's not just a matter of raising money, but actually getting in there and-- 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  05:02 
Yeah, the real-- 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  05:07 
--teaching them.  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  05:08 
--humanitarian side of it, also.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  05:13 
I see. Any awards, honors, ribbons? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  05:17 
Myself, personally, no, except the gratitude in the hours, except that Clipped Wings Seattle 
Chapter has been probably one of the outstanding chapters in the 25 years, not only in money 
donated to retarded, but in the total hours spent with these children. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  05:49 
Okay. Mother's name? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  05:52 
Mary Welvaert. W-E-L--  
 
Page 5 of 18 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  05:56 
W-E-L. 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  05:59 
--V-A-E-R-T.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  06:00 
Okay, let's see. Married name was Vercoutere. Do you know a year of birth? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  06:21 
My mother's?  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  06:21 
Yes. 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  06:24 
August 6, 1901.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  06:32 
Place?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  06:33 
Right outside Ghent, Belgium. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  07:04 
Marriage date? At least a year?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  07:05 
Mother and Daddy were married in April -- oh, Lord -- probably around 1920, '21.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  07:14 
Place? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  07:15 
Marshall, Minnesota. They were married in this country. She was born in '01. She was 20 when 
she got married, so-- 19 or 20. It'd be around the '20s, yeah. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  07:37 
Uh-huh. Year of death, or is she still alive?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  07:41 
She's still alive.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  07:43 
She was Belgian [inaudible]. 
 
Page 6 of 18 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  07:45 
Mm-hmm.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  07:45 
Okay, she hold any occupations, jobs?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  07:50 
No.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  07:51 
So, homemaker.  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  07:53 
Right. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  07:56 
Okay, and your father's name?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  07:59 
John. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  08:04 
Vercoutere. Year of birth [inaudible]? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  08:07 
Daddy was eight years older, so that would put us back to about 1893. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  08:15 
Place?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  08:18 
He was born in Brussels, Belgium. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  08:24 
And is he still alive?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  08:32 
No. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  08:36 
What year did he die?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  08:44 
About 1952. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  08:48 
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And place?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  08:52 
He died in Minnesota.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  08:55 
Okay, and he was also Belgian. 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  09:01 
Mm-hmm. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  09:01 
And his occupation or jobs?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  09:06 
My father had a grocery store and butcher shop, the old fashioned kind. Chopping-- that's where 
the original chopping block came from.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  09:20 
Okay, have any brothers or sisters?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  09:25 
I have an older brother, Paul, and a younger sister, Pat. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  09:53 
Okay, any cousins"?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  09:54 
Oh, tons of them. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  09:55 
[Laughs.]  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  09:55 
Reams and reams of cousins.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  09:57 
Okay, I won't even try and figure that one out at the moment. Do you remember your 
grandparents?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  10:03 
Very well.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  10:06 
Okay, grandmothers-- or that's right. [Telephone rings] Oops. [Tape cuts.] 
 
Page 8 of 18 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  10:10 
Okay, now we gotta distinguish between maternal and paternal. Okay, do you remember your 
grand-- maternal grandmother's name? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  10:21 
Well, unfortunately, all I remember is my grandfather's name. But-- gosh, I don't know her 
maiden name, but it was Welvaert, her married name.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  10:35 
Okay. What was her first name?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  10:44 
Marie.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  10:44 
Okay, and your paternal?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  10:52 
George.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  10:56 
No. Paternal grandmother.  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  11:01 
Her first name?  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  11:02 
Mm-hmm. 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  11:03 
I haven't the foggiest idea. I don't remember my-- my paternal grandmother died about six 
months after she arrived in this country.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  11:18 
So paternal grandfather's name was George Vercoutere? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  11:20 
Mm-hmm.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  11:21 
Maternal grandfather's first name?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  11:22 
Henry.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  11:27 
Page 9 of 18 
 
Henry. And you don't remember-- you don't have an idea about the maiden names on either...? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  11:35 
No, unfortunately, no. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  11:37 
How about maternal grandmother's year of birth? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  11:43 
I don't really know. I have no genealogy on my family at all. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  11:49 
Okay, so you don't know anybody's year of birth or death dates that much, or places of birth? But 
they were all Belgian? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  11:58 
Yeah, all. All came over probably within six months of one another, not knowing the other 
family had come. Because my parents did not meet until they arrived in this country, in Marshall 
and Ghent, Belgium. Ghent really was populated by all people from Belgium. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  12:22 
There's a town in Minnesota called Ghent [laughs]?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  12:25 
Ghent, Minnesota, because they all came from that area in Belgium. And why they chose that 
area of Minnesota to live and populate, I will never know. My-- when I was growing up, I 
worked in the store with my father, in the grocery store and butcher's shop, and the language was 
all Belgian. Everyone spoke Belgian. So I grew up knowing the language and speaking it very 
fluently. Unfortunately, in past 20 years, I've lost it all. But the entire-- the population of that 
town, I would say, was 98% Belgian people who had settled there from Europe.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  13:10 
Okay, and was this, mainly Flemish Belgian, rather than the French-speaking--?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  13:16 
There are two very distinct Belgian languages, the French and the Flem— 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  13:21 
I know that. 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  13:21 
Yeah, and Mother spoke one, and my father spoke the other. So it was a real hassle as to who 
was right and who was wrong. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  13:28 
So which did you mainly grow up speaking, Flemish or--? 
Page 10 of 18 
 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  13:32 
Half of each, because I would work with mother in the house and speak one version of the 
Belgian language and and then working in the store with my father, spoke the other version of 
the Belgian. It was a constant source of irritation between the two. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  13:49 
Okay, and you don't remember, particularly, anybody's occupations, or...? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  13:55 
Oh, my maternal grandfather was a carpenter, and my paternal grandfather was a farmer. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  14:05 
And women were homemakers?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  14:08 
Well, yes, until the war. War would-- came along, the First World War. And then my 
grandmother... My Uncle Phil was a professional bicycle rider and also a spy. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  14:23 
[Laughs] In this country or in Belgium? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  14:26 
In Belgium. And--  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  14:30 
Made a living by pedaling bicycles?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  14:33 
By being a professional bicycle and then also working for the Underground. And he was put in a 
con-- in a German prison camp for about six months, as was my grandmother for three weeks, 
for smuggling food. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  14:48 
So, she was working for some sort of underground resistance, or whatever, against the Germans? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  15:01 
Both-- mm-hmm. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  15:02 
Germans-- 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  15:04 
And [inaudible] have the unfortunate misfortune of being caught.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  15:12 
Page 11 of 18 
 
Yeah, that's right, Belgium was mostly behind German lines-- 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  15:17 
Right, right.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  15:18 
--in World War I. Okay, spouse's name was Donald. And his year of birth? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  15:26 
Eight years older than me. I was born in '28. He was born in '21.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  15:34 
Don't remember the date [inaudible]?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  15:37 
Yeah, June 21. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  15:43 
Okay, place? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  15:48 
Milwaukee, Wisconsin. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  15:49 
And he's still alive?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  15:51 
No.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  15:52 
Oh [inaudible]. Year of death?  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  15:55 
'76. Place?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  15:55 
1976.  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  16:05 
Right here in Seattle. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  16:12 
His occupation or job?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  16:13 
He was president of the Black Manufacturing Company. 
Page 12 of 18 
 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  16:20 
Black Manufacturing. What did they manufacture? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  16:22 
Ski jackets.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  16:23 
Oh. 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  16:24 
On Rainier Avenue. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  16:30 
Children's names?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  16:33 
David, Steven-- 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  16:39 
With a V or a PH?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  16:39 
Right.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  16:40 
V. Okay. 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  16:42 
--and Michael. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  16:51 
Place of birth?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  16:52 
David was born in Saint Paul, Minnesota. Steven was born in Seattle, and Michael was born in 
Seattle.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  17:05 
Okay. And date of birth? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  17:08 
David was born in March of 1951, Steven was born in June 1954, and Michael was born July 
1956. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  17:27 
Page 13 of 18 
 
And occupations? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  17:29 
David is a salesman for Matthew Bender, legal text. David-- excuse me, Steven coaches 
basketball and teaches in Pasco, Washington.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  17:47 
Pasco. 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  17:58 
And Michael is still a student at Bellevue Community in Communications, and also works as a 
professional referee. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  18:08 
Oh, sport-- a couple of them are rather sports-minded. 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  18:15 
I know. Two of the original jocks. [They laugh.] 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  18:20 
Any adopted children or foster children?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  18:23 
No. No. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  18:24 
To your background, now. When you were growing up, which parent did you feel you were 
closer to?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  18:33 
My father.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  18:35 
Father? Any particular reason why? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  18:39 
Well, I enjoyed working with him. I enjoyed his sense of humor and his attitude toward life in 
general. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  18:48 
What sort of sense of humor did he have? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  18:50 
Sort of a devil-may-care attitude. He had a great feeling for responsibility, but also felt that as 
you progress through life, make the most of every situation, and always feel free to be doing the 
things you wanted to do without hurting someone, and yet enjoying yourself. His philosophy 
Page 14 of 18 
 
was, if you can't enjoy what you're doing, be it a job or a hobby or anything, then you're in the 
wrong field.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  19:21 
And he enjoyed running his butcher shop? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  19:23 
Absolutely, absolutely. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  19:26 
And what sort of person was your mother? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  19:30 
I would say in-- very, very typical for that age group that we were growing up in, the strict 
disciplinarian, church-going... I would say in general, just, you know, the house dress, apron 
mother that everything had to run on schedule. There wasn't any time for a lot of side streets. 
You're, like, just a strict matriarch of the family. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  20:00 
Okay, on your brother and your sister, did you feel closer to one of them? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  20:00 
My sister.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  20:01 
Sister? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  20:01 
Mm-hmm.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  20:01 
And why was that?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  20:16 
She was younger, and I just always felt that she just-- she was-- growing up, she was shy, and I 
just felt that she should be sharing some of the things I was doing and enjoying them, and where 
her tendency was more toward being a bookworm and enjoying that sort of thing, mine was more 
of a-- my father's attitude, [?completely?]. So I was-- I've always grown up feeling a lot closer to 
her than my brother.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  20:51 
Okay, were there any particular discussions or arguments in your family over things like 
education or philosophy of how to raise the kids?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  21:05 
Page 15 of 18 
 
No, no. It was just understood that, because my parents had nothing more than a grade school 
education, there was never any question, any doubt, that we were going to college. I mean, that 
was probably drunged at-- into us and at us from the time we knew what college was. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  21:26 
Okay, so, there was, in general, an emphasis on education in your house?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  21:35 
Absolutely, absolutely. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  21:37 
How about anything like arts, or sports, or any--?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  21:41 
Sports, my father was always enthusiastic about sports and made a great effort to have my 
brother follow them, but my brother as-- well, in the brain department, when they passed it out, 
they skipped right over me and gave more of my share and more to my brother and sister. So he 
was always interested more in math and that sort of thing. So he pursued more the educational 
role, rather than the sport-minded role, in high school and college. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  22:16 
Were you ever interested in any sort of sports at all? Swimming? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  22:19 
No. Athletic as an ashtray.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  22:21 
[Laughs.] 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  22:22 
Absolutely, absolutely. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  22:25 
Okay. Were there any kids in the neighborhood, or anyhow, that you grew up with that you felt 
closer to or were around more? You pretty much grew up in the same town? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  22:41 
Yes, very small town. I think total population-- well, Ghent was just sort of an offshoot of 
Marshall, and I think the total population, counting everything, was about 8000. Yes, I had 
several very close friends in high school that resulted in, or came as a result of, being in the 
drama group. From-- quick-- back in those days, we went through eight grades and then a four-
year high school. So we all started out in high school at the same level, as freshmen. And, oh, 
there were several girls who were in drama and that sort of thing that I enjoyed, and we-- still, 
we are in touch [inaudible] letter and communication of that sort.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  23:35 
Page 16 of 18 
 
Okay, were there-- remember any sort of particular customs that the Belgians had that seemed to 
characterize them or differentiate them from their--  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  23:49 
Well, I don't know-- 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  23:51 
--neighbors? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  23:51 
--whether you mean hobbies.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  23:52 
Well, whatever, you know. Well, since it's near the season to be jolly and whatnot, Christmas 
customs, or wedding customs, or anything like that?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  24:03 
The wedding traditions in Belgium I'm not familiar with, and they-- coming from the Old World 
to the New World, they were very, very anxious to do things as was expected of them in this 
country. So they immediately dropped all of their traditions -- a great many, I should say -- and 
were more than anxious to pick up the New World customs, so that weddings and that sort of 
thing were always done according to the American tradition. But now, around Christmas, such as 
this time of year, it was always a tradition to go over to Grandmother's and bake these lukken, 
they're called in Belgian. And they're a flat cookie-- 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  24:48 
Lukken? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  24:49 
--called lukken. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  24:50 
L-U-- 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  24:51 
--K-E-N. I would-- yeah. And it's a flat, waffle-type cookie that's just paper, paper thin, and it's 
done on a grill. And my grandmother did that every Sunday for about three Sundays before 
Christmas, and it was just every grandchild, and cousin, and brother and sister, or whatever, 
always met at Grandmother's to do that. And always served with it were wine, red-- which she 
made herself. And with that--  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  25:26 
The kids got a little wine, too?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  25:27 
Page 17 of 18 
 
Oh, absolutely. Oh, absolutely. Everybody got in on that [they laugh] and they didn't-- the one 
custom they did not believe in as far as trimming a tree was anything but natural, be it strung 
cranberry, strung popcorn, fruit. There were no lights on the tree, and it was more or less the fruit 
of the harvest, I would think, that that tree was never lit, really. It was just laden with all the 
fruits and natural farm products. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  26:06 
Did they grow much in the way of grapes in the Minnesota [inaudible]?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  26:09 
Not really. No, not really.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  26:11 
I was just wondering where they got the grapes to make the wine. 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  26:14 
No, she had them shipped in. She bought them and actually did them herself. And the cookies--  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  26:20 
Did she get out in a tub with her bare feet?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  26:23 
She had an old wooden tub right next to the henhouse when they were living on the farm, and 
this thing gurgled kind of all year. I don't-- I really never asked any particulars about it, other 
than I was aware that it was there. It was it was like walking into anybody's home and seeing the 
refrigerator. It's just there. And you just knew that this-- whether it [?perc'ed?] all year, I knew 
one thing, it was strong. It tasted just awful, like an old sock. But she thought it was delicious, 
and she drank it with every meal, as did my grandfather. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  27:06 
Now, this is the maternal or paternal side?  
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  27:08 
Maternal, because, you see, my paternal grandmother died, I think, three or four months after she 
arrived in this country. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  27:18 
Oh, yeah, that's right. Okay, now, the thing is, most people associate Minnesota with being a 
place where you have all of the Scandinavians. Were you-- was it-- it was just this little Belgian 
pocket surrounded mainly by Scandinavians? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  27:41 
Yes, there were a lot of-- oh, you're talking about the "Olsens" and the "Jansens" and that. They 
were more-- this was in the southwest corner of Minnesota. The Scandinavian people were more 
into the Iron Ranges in the northern part of Minnesota. And and the horse-- and the horseshoeing 
Page 18 of 18 
 
and that sort of part of the-- when working up in the coal mines in the iron ranges, Scandinavian 
people were up in there.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  28:15 
I see. When did you become aware of the fact that you were sort-- you were Belgian, of Belgian 
anc--? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  28:24 
Well, at first, I resented it. I really, truly did, because everybody else was born and raised-- 
parents were born and raised in and about Marshall, and they all-- my immediate peer group, 
[inaudible] said enjoyed my parents tremendously, but said they had a funny accent. And it 
wasn't until then, I think, from the transition from eighth grade to my freshman year in high 
school, and I resented it. I thought, "Oh dear, we're all freaky because we're from another 
country," not realizing that the whole majority of this country at one time, was from the Old 
World, and I should have been very proud, and it was a unique situation that they came to this 
country. And then I think that was my first real indication. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  29:13 
Do you have any idea why you were--? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere  29:15 
I wanted to be just like everybody else. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  29:15 
No, I meant why your parents came to this country? Your grandparents? 
 
Jeanne Ellen Vercoutere Biehn  29:24 
Well, I think, like the dream of everybody else. America was paved with gold, and there was 
opportunity here. And my mother, when my mother came over with her parents, she left behind a 
sister in Belgium who was-- who opted to go into the convent rather than to come to this country, 
because she was afraid-- she was just afraid. And in those days, from the tales my mother told, 
either a young girl got married or went into the convent and became a nun and thereby having all 
the security that the convent had to offer that a marriage would have to offer, and she would be 
taken care of for the rest of her life. I had the opportunity to meet her, never having met her, 
about five years ago. And she'd come to the country, and it was amazing, in just our 
conversation, what I didn't pick up of my old Belgian. But she's since passed away.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  30:29 
Uh-- 